Intellectual property

[Tsunami]

I was wondering, since I write very often (a whole variety from proza to articles and essays) ... Sometimes I spend a lot of emotional energy on my writings, or hours and hours of research. The times when I feel proud about the result (which happens not all the times obviously) I do feel like I would like to "copyright" my writings.

In my native country there is an organisation which deals with intellectual property, ranging from songs to literature and essays. People can register their writing in a sort of "depot" and thereby become the official owner of their creation. Even while I live abroad already for several years, the organisation in my native place was the first one where I checked. Registering your writing is easy, but it's bloody expensive. 30 to 40 euro per piece, for one writing with a relatively high frequency that's a bit disencouraging. I will probably inform as well how things are elsewhere where I'd have the right to do it (I'm not sure if you can register your writings anywhere you wish or if it has to be in either your country of citizenship or country of residence)

Anyways, since many young artists probably want to use such protection, I'm sure an affordable option must exist? Does anyone know about this and have some hints for me?

PS: not claiming that I'd be a talented writer, I just write to vent my emotions. However, regardless if other people would like my writings, they are my creations and there is an emotional connection with them. Hence why I'd like to register them in my name, even when I know I probably won't be the next big novelist

[Empath]

Copyright is automatic when you put your composition into print. You can register it if you wish, as an extra level of legal proof of ownership, but the copyright is there regardless. If it's important to call notice to the copyright, you can also include a notice of copyright with the material, along with the commonly recognized symbol, © .

Something you might want to consider, is the placement of your material. Some areas, such as message boards or websites include an agreement regarding the use of your submissions, and how they can be used. There may be some writings that you wouldn't want to post in an area that has required a membership agreement permitting them to edit and/or use your material in a collaborative work or in other ways. It's not that there is anything wrong with such an agreement, it's just that you need to be aware of how you might be granting rights of publication without intent.

[ChinaLamb]

This is for the USA: Please not the following from the following site:
http://www.webmasterworld.com/forum44/1305.htm
((Since it was not copyrighted, I just copied it...))

Sample:
© Copyright Company, 1999-2005. All rights reserved.

...in order to be valid, it has to contain the company/publisher, the word 'copyright' or the © symbol and the year(s).

A copyright notice has 3 elements:

1. The symbol ©, or the word "copyright," or the abbreviation "Copr."
2. The year of first publication of the work; and
3. The name of the author.

While use of a copyright notice was once required as a condition of copyright protection, it is now optional.

When is my work protected?
Your work is under copyright protection the moment it is created and fixed in a tangible form that it is perceptible either directly or with the aid of a machine or device.

There's a wealth of information available at the US copyright Office web site.
http://www.copyright.gov/

[janusz]

Originally Posted by ChinaLamb

from the following site:
http://www.webmasterworld.com/forum44/1305.htm
((Since it was not copyrighted, I just copied it...))

Really? The bottom (ok, nearly bottom....) line says

All trademarks and copyrights held by respective owners. Member comments are owned by the poster.

[ChinaLamb]

Originally Posted by janusz

Really? The bottom (ok, nearly bottom....) line says

Oops, at least I credited my source....

[Tsunami]

But what confuses me is the term "placement" when it says that the copyright is there as soon as it is published in some form or another (maybe the fact English is not my mothertongue means that I fail to understand some terms)

If I write an article/short story/whatever I wish to later use in a publication, but this chapter or story is already finished and I either print it to store it at home or I email it to my best friend ... In a way the thing I wrote has been printed already, but because it's not in a published book or anything yet, anyone that I read it to could claim they were the first one who wrote it.

So how do I assure that my writing is my intellectual property then? I mean, it's normal that you don't publish something right after finishing it, but it's also normal that the finished parts of the works should be mine as I was the one writing them.



I will tomorrow read carefully through the websites cited, but in the comments of the above posters a few words make me confused probably due to the fact that I am not a native speaker and not familiar with some juridical terms (eg "tangible" form = is me emailing a writing to a friend considered tangible ? And how to proof that I wrote it in case publication in public, eg book or website, only occurs once more chapters or articles are finished?).

Thanks to all who gave advise!

[ChinaLamb]

Easy,
Send yourself and someone else a copy of what you wrote and digitally sign it. Or send a copy to yourself in the registered mail. Don't open it. If you ever want to sue someone, open it in front of the judge.

You can use those or any other variety of things to prove that you wrote some work at a certain date.

US copyright law has grown to include anything that anyone ever wrote. Doesn't need to be "published" through a publisher, it could be published on an online blog system. You could publish it yourself by printing it yourself.

All you need is something to prove you wrote it on the date you say wrote it.

/cl

[Tsunami]

Thanks. How does copyright laws apply internationally then? I asked a local artist here where I live and he says he sometimes registered his work for only a few euro at a special government organised commission for intellectual property. It sounds a bit too good to be true so I do wish to verify that, however even if it's true: imagine I register my writings here, would the intellectual property be valid internationally?

Complex issue, but I am a curious guy and I like to know how these things work ... even when I realise the chances of having an audience beyond the local pub scene or local magazines is relatively small, it cannot do harm to know how these laws function.

[ChinaLamb]

Copyright in the EU is different than in the United States – and unusually, much less rigidly controlled by the government. In the United States, there is an official Copyright Office which registers copyrights. Even though the USA is a signatory to the Berne Convention whereby a work should be protected without such registration, nobody has ever won damages in the USA for infringement where a copyright was not filed with the copyright office according to their procedures.

http://www.eucopyright.org/


And also:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyrig...European_Union
http://www.ivir.nl/publications/huge...-Engelberg.doc
http://ec.europa.eu/internal_market/...t/index_en.htm

[n5bb]

I beg to differ on one point, CL. US Copyright law has no provision for "poor man's copyright" (sending the work to yourself), so although that might seem convincing it appears to not be supported by law. You can register a work at any time after it is created, even after infringement. But there are certain advantages to registration, and you need to register before filing a lawsuit. See the Copyright Basics document. I have no special knowledge -- I'm just reading from the US Copyright office website.

Also read this site concerning "poor man's copyright" and how it can be easily faked so is useless.

Bill

[ChinaLamb]

Originally Posted by n5bb

I beg to differ on one point, CL. US Copyright law has no provision for "poor man's copyright" (sending the work to yourself), so although that might seem convincing it appears to not be supported by law. You can register a work at any time after it is created, even after infringement. But there are certain advantages to registration, and you need to register before filing a lawsuit. See the Copyright Basics document. I have no special knowledge -- I'm just reading from the US Copyright office website.

Also read this site concerning "poor man's copyright" and how it can be easily faked so is useless.

Bill

Good info.

My idea wouldn't work anyway as Tsunami is in the EU which has different laws.

The website you posted is good, does offer a few suggestions, like getting the work notarized, send it from a public fax machine, or send from an internet cafe that you have to log into.

I imagine it would be pretty hard to fake it if you sent it to yourself in Gmail. Don't see how you could change the date there either....

Anyhoo, good information, Bill.

/cl

[Tsunami]

EUcopyright.org has a redirection to an online registration service

Price list seems a bit more expensive than registering it locally with the local government's office for intellectual property. However, two questions rise in my head:

- can I register for example 20 articles at once as it if was 1 work consisting of several chapters, or do I need to pay the price for each article separately?

- if I register it with the local authority for intellectual property in the country where I live, does the copyright count for the entire country, or internationally? It is cheaper locally but it may be a wiser option to pay the few extra bucks to have the protection internationally ...

[Tsunami]

Well, I did a lot of research and calling around and appears that here it is quite cheap. Less than 5 € to register a piece of proza, a collection of poems, an article or collection thereof, ... Easy and cheap

The one thing I still didn't grasp is the difference between copyright and intellectual property. It was explained to me by one guy working for the local governmental office for intellectual property as follows: "copyright is basically a sign indicating not to copy the creation - it is mostly used for programs, designs and technical items. When you want to prove your authorship and hold the rights (= legally own ??) your poems or articles or proze, you don't have to care about copyrights but about intellectual property". The latter can be registered at the local governmental office for less than 5€ per item you register ; but is the explanation above true that intellectual property gives you the rights to what you wrote (= you legally own it) and that copyright is a totally different thing?


PS: intellectual property is valid in all countries who signed the Bern treaty (which in practice is like 90% of the world) and the intellectual property/authorship is valid until 70 years past the death of the author. That is what I was explained.

[Tsunami]

I was just wondering... If I write an entry/article and post it either in a blog or at a website, does the webhost/blog host own the intellectual property or is the person who posted the content the one owning it?

I got worried about this after reading the terms and conditions of some free hosting sites such as Yola.com where it is said the webhost remains the owner of intellectual property of ... and then I'm not sure if they refer to anything on their servers (including the stuff you post there) or only the software they offer you to create the site while you are the owner of the content you post. The terms (go to yola.com or weebly.com and read the terms) do state they have an unlimited license to adapt, spread or copy your content for the promotion of your site but that's very vague.



So this question is both about the writings and articles you can post on a website or in a blog : does the host of your blog/website own everything you post, or do they only have the rights to the software they provide while the user is owning the intellectual property of the content posted?



PS: for several of my writings I registered the intellectual property already. I am however worried that if I'd post them on a website or in a blog, that it may have consequences for the intellectual property which is currently in my name and should remain so.

[n5bb]

Originally Posted by Tsunami

I was just wondering... If I write an entry/article and post it either in a blog or at a website, does the webhost/blog host own the intellectual property or is the person who posted the content the one owning it? ...

Well, this site is powered by vBulletin code, so these comments might be appropriate.

My understanding is that the blog or forum host doesn't have any intellectual property rights just because I post these comments I'm now writing at this site. The creator of the content should normally be the owner of the rights. And this means that there are other possibilities which you didn't list:

• You could post content which is already in the public domain. For example, I can post some of the contents of the US Constitution freely -- but I don't receive any rights just because I have posted the creation of others.
• You could post content which is copyrighted or otherwise protected by others (private information or corporate/government secrets). The act of you posting the material can't possibly give you any additional rights, since you didn't own them.
• You could post content which you own, but which against the terms of the blog system or forum. Since you have explicitly or implicitly agreed to the terms of use of the system, any posts you make must comply with those requirements, and so your content could get edited or removed, even though you own rights to it.
• I think that most of us would agree that anything one posts on a public forum (such as this one) is normally expected to be available for others to use.
• But if you set expectations on your personal blog that your content posted there is copyrighted, I would expect that others would be expected to consider this content yours. But many people put material from others on their blogs, and ignore the copyright of others. So this is a murky area due to sloppy actions by blog writers, I would think.

It's obvious that news outlets have a big problem with such issues these days. I can find websites with news items lifted verbatim from copyrighted articles by other news sites. The moment that these items are put on personal blogs, nobody realizes that these were copyrighted articles. The sources of the content are rarely described, and if small changes accumulate it's the old children's game of whispering a story to one person, who whispers it to the next person, resulting in a completely different story at the end of a chain of 20 people.

Bill